[Shadowrun]Troll modified Cyberarms

Gyro · Post by **Gyro** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 7:39 pm

A quick question here. Troll cyberarms. Paul and I were dscussing cybernetic arms and storage space. My character is a troll, which means I pay a bit extra for Troll modified equipment and cybernetics. Okay cool.

But would a troll modified (synthetic appearence or natural if you prefer) have more than the listed ECU (As listed in M&M Pg.36) which is 5?

Also lets say I am planning on storing a heavy pistol or a Micro Uzi (unloaded in the latter case.).

So we decided I'd get a consensus from here. Any help?

Ancient History · Post by **Ancient History** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 7:43 pm

I don't believe you get any extra space. I mean, troll cyberarms already have a base strength of 8, it's not like they're strength 3 human cyberarms with a lot of padding around it for putting junk in.

Gyro · Post by **Gyro** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 7:50 pm

While I agree basically with your posts general theme-"You're already getting a pretty good deal, and Troll strength does mean the arms need more "stuff" to make them work" I have to question at least part of it.

Yes it will require some more "servos" or "motors" or whatever it is that powers them-but that much more? Am I just being naive?

Insomniac Jack · Post by **Insomniac Jack** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 10:08 pm

I think since no trolls, or cyber arms, exist it will be really difficult for any one to say how much junk you have to put inside an arm to make it work. It would be a safe bet to say its easier just to leave it the same as human arms, but I also think it will take away from one of the trolls disadvantages. Being friggin huge. They are big, and have to put up with modifications that allow them to live in a world built way to small for them. giving them to many additional advantages may sap the negatives away.

or not. I don't care.

Serious Paul · Post by **Serious Paul** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 11:24 pm

Say smartass

where are you and your homeboy right now?

We're in the middle of some massive bugginess!

FlakJacket · Post by **FlakJacket** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 11:24 pm

Does adding extra strength mods to a human cyberarm take away ECU? If yes then they get the standard ECU, if not then you could probably talk your way clear to getting an increase.

Archimedes · Post by **Archimedes** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 7:49 pm

I never saw the point of giving a troll a cyberarm. Too much essence and the cost to get your strength to the equivalent of the rest of your body. If you're worried about concealling a weapon, then why not get a modified sheath by your forearm so you could derringer it. My last GM let me derringer a hand cannon for my troll-variant. I would say quicker access to your weapon if you derringer it as opposed to having to take it out of your forearm anyway.

But if we're just talking theoreticals about troll cybers then my guess would be slightly less ECU for what you get. I mean, at that size with a troll cyberarm you could start adding industrial machine/factory components for lifting and strength that a human frame simply could not support. Those aren't small. Besides, with some of those components you might actually need an additional power source to run it. GM's discretion of course.

sinsual · Post by **sinsual** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 10:01 pm

Even if you figure that a troll modified cyberarm needs larger equipment to make it work...the size of the arm balances that out. However at the same time, if a troll arm is 1.5 times larger then a human arm, the extra storage space will also be 1.5 times larger then in a human arm. Also a human cyber arm isn;t limited in strength by the amount of space it has, its limited in strength by the frailty of the human torso its attached to. Fo example, I have 2 identical hydrolic bottle jacks, one uses 90w hydrolic fluid and the other uses 120wt hydrolic fluid. the lighter weight fluid is used in the 300olb capicty and the heavier is rated at 5000lb capicity. Higher strength with only a change in fluid weight.

Archimedes · Post by **Archimedes** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 4:21 am

You made a good point on the physics end of it, but on gaming terms, I can build you a better and cheaper troll without the cyberarm.

Salvation122 · Post by **Salvation122** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 4:41 am

I get the feeling that Paul's group's character design philosophy is a lot less about crunching numbers and a lot more about building things to fit their history. There's nothing wrong with either view - as a sometimes wargamer, I'm just as likely to use the former over the later depending on the occaision - but there's a certain elegance in ignoring effectiveness to accurately model a character concept.

Plus, for all we know, he got the cyber as a result of having a limb blown off mid-run.

Archimedes · Post by **Archimedes** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 4:59 am

Sorry, I've been away from gaming for a little while because a lot of the more recent ones involved munchkins and I did adopt the mindset for a moment. Good point about actually building a character and not a statistic.

As per getting an arm blown off, can't they grow a bio-replacement? Time and Nuyen, sure, but I thought it was possible.

Salvation122 · Post by **Salvation122** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 5:51 am

Hey, no problem. It's something I've been having issues with in Warhammer of late, as well; balancing effectiveness versus composition/fluff/character is sometimes very hard to do, particularly when the point of the game is to actually win, not create a story.

paladin2019 · Post by **paladin2019** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 3:03 pm

Salvation122 wrote:Hey, no problem. It's something I've been having issues with in Warhammer of late, as well; balancing effectiveness versus composition/fluff/character is sometimes very hard to do, particularly when the point of the game is to actually win, not create a story.

Not according to GW's press releases.

But then, they still sponsor tournaments, don't they.