What is it with retailers these days? [Rant]

[UncleJoseph]

I hate big box retailers. Places like Best Buy used to have sound rooms and video rooms with at least some specialty equipment that wasn't available at every Walmart. However, I've noticed in the last 10 years or so, the big box retailers have dropped so many of their product lines. They now just offer very streamlined choices, but choices that appeal to more to average consumers who don't do any research on products or want anything other than what everyone else has. I've noticed this in sporting goods too.

In my area, we used to have a sporting goods store called "Galyan's." They carried a lot of specialty rock climbing, hiking and camping gear that wasn't on the shelf at a lot of other stores. They had a large rock-climbing wall in the store, and very knowledgeable staff. They carried a full selection of shooting sports equipment, including firearms. After about 3-4 years, they got bought out by Dicks Sporting Goods, a large big-box retailer. Almost overnight, their product lines disappeared, their staff was replaced by know-nothings, and it became one of the worst places for me to shop for sporting goods. Now they have mostly the same stuff I can buy at Walmart or Meijer, just at higher prices. Their staff has very little product knowledge, and most of them do not have hobbies that match anything they sell.

Now, either my tastes are way off the charts for normal, or there just aren't any choices anymore. We have a couple of small, locally owned gun shops too, and they don't stock anything that I would consider to be common. Today I drove to two of those shops, and nobody knew about the products I was looking for, and/or they didn't have anything in stock. I prefer to support my local businesses if possible, but I find myself shopping online more and more because I can never find what I want locally (and my tastes are not exotic at all!!!). Add that to the complete lack of product knowledge most of the sales staff have, and I have nothing but very bad shopping experiences. So I got home and placed an order with Midway USA (a decent online company)...no other alternative.

[3278]

I hate big box retailers. Places like Best Buy used to have sound rooms and video rooms with at least some specialty equipment that wasn't available at every Walmart.

I noticed this lack when I wanted to buy some Polk speakers for...I don't know, one of the last 18 cars I had. We went into an ABC Warehouse, and their car audio section looked like they'd just had a robbery: empty shelves, empty speaker holes, wires coming out of everything, nothing hooked up so I could hear it. This, though, is different from the question you're really asking in this thread: I think car audio, as a market, is just dead compared to the heyday of the 90s. But your question really is:

However, I've noticed in the last 10 years or so, the big box retailers have dropped so many of their product lines. They now just offer very streamlined choices, but choices that appeal to more to average consumers who don't do any research on products or want anything other than what everyone else has.

And the answer to "why" is: the internet. Their margins in these stores are much better if they just shoot for the fat center of the bell curve, the 90 percent of unsophisticated, lazy, or desperate people who will just grab whatever off the shelf and buy it. There's no benefit in stocking esoteric items that fill up shelf space and are bought by one expert every year, because that expert orders online. They don't benefit from selling to the long tail, because the internet is a much better place to market to those rare few.

But it sucks, because a lot of this stuff isn't something I'd want to buy online. I'm going to dump $1000 into a stereo system I can't hear until I get it installed? No way. Computers, yes: I know what a Core 2 Quad will do. Clothes, no: I don't know how they'll fit until I try them on. Guns, no: I don't know how it'll feel to hold until I pick it up.

We don't buy a lot of stuff, but when we do, we buy things we don't need to hold off Amazon - lots of reviews, broad availability - and stuff we have to buy in person off Craigslist, because we can find it, and go to it, and watch it work. But buying rare new things? We're at an impasse. [Not that it comes up very often. ] We could always buy and send back, but shipping costs make that pretty expensive for people on a budget. It sucks.

[Salvation122]

There used to be a lot of problems with people going and getting demos of stuff, and then turning around and snagging it on Amazon for 20% off, too. The retailers wisely said "fuck that guy" and quit caring, since he was costing them money.

[UncleJoseph]

There used to be a lot of problems with people going and getting demos of stuff, and then turning around and snagging it on Amazon for 20% off, too. The retailers wisely said "fuck that guy" and quit caring, since he was costing them money.

That's an excellent point. I worked in retali shooting sports all through college, back when the internet was gaining a lot of steam. Online ordering started to compete with brick-and-mortar sales like crazy. I used to get a lot of people coming into the store who would pump us for our knowledge for hours, then not buy anything. We knew they were going to pick up their stuff online, or they'd end the conversation with, "Cabela's sells that same product for much cheaper." Brick-and-morter used to compete with mail order, but the price differences weren't that significant. Online discount warehouses changed all that. I've taken advantage of the price differences myself, especially when you consider the price of gas. Why drive to a place 1-2 hours away when you can have it delivered to your door for cheaper, and without wasting the travel time or fuel?

Still, as 32 mentions above, certain products really need to be purchased in person. These are the products I'm having a hard time finding.

[UncleJoseph]

And the answer to "why" is: the internet. Their margins in these stores are much better if they just shoot for the fat center of the bell curve, the 90 percent of unsophisticated, lazy, or desperate people who will just grab whatever off the shelf and buy it. There's no benefit in stocking esoteric items that fill up shelf space and are bought by one expert every year, because that expert orders online. They don't benefit from selling to the long tail, because the internet is a much better place to market to those rare few.

I guess I'm wishing for more of a balance. In many cases, the products I'm looking for aren't really specialty items, when considered against the sport. Sure, a couple of parts for a specific gun might not be considered a mainstream retail product, but in the shooting sports world, these parts would normally be considered so commonplace it would be odd not to stock them. But lately, the trend appears to be the extreme version of the bell curve you mentioned above. Anything that falls outside of the dead center of the bell curve is considered a specialty item.

My grandfather was a retail manager of J.C. Penney for over 30 years at several major stores. His stores were always very successful in terms of sales, which is why he kept getting promoted to larger and larger stores. One of his guiding philosophies was that the store had to have what people wanted in order to make the sale. So he always stocked tons of the most popular sizes of clothing, but also stocked plenty of the oddball sizes. He was very good at not overstocking, however. This seems to be a dying art among retailers. Of course, my grandfather didn't have to compete with the internet, but his store was rarely out of stock on any product needed by any customer.

[UncleJoseph]

The other issue I have is with customer service. About 5 days ago, I called our local furniture store, from which we have purchased nearly a house full of furniture. They do upholstery repair, and we have some vinyl that needs to be touched up due to our cat's claws. I called and requested info on the repair. The manager advised that the repair tech was out for the day, but took my name and number and told me he'd have the service tech call me the next day or the day after that, depending on his repair schedule. That was 5 days ago. Still no call. Increasingly, I've experienced rude, uninterested or totally incompetent sales clerks, service techs, etc. It's like the whole customer service industry has severe ADHD.

When I bought my truck a year and a half ago, the salesperson did everything he could to make the sale. There were some issues with the truck that were supposed to be resolved before I purchased (minor things). They never got resolved...things that were supposed to be included weren't and when I returned to have them addressed, the salesperson acted like he did not know who I was. He had no interest in meeting his agreed-upon obligations. A complaint to the sales manager got me an $80 check for repairs that cost me 3X that on my own. None of the other things that were supposed to be included in the sale were ever given to me (floor mats, a couple extra keys and a few other items). I didn't make a bigger stink about any of it because I got a great price on the truck. But it was an easy sale for them...I didn't haggle too much and I have great credit, so the whole deal was done in less than an hour. But I'll never buy a car from that dealership again.

I routinely experience poor service from almost everywhere. The service is so poor in some places that I won't shop there anymore. But I can't imagine I'm the only one. So are all these businesses losing customers at a staggering rate? I'm a reasonable customer...I worked in retail so I always go out of my way not to be that assholish customer whose demands are always unreasonable. But I feel like stores have gone the way of the shady used car salesman: Tell every customer anything you can to get their money, then move on to the next sucker.

[3278]

So are all these businesses losing customers at a staggering rate?

I guess if everyone sucks at customer service the same amount, customers have nowhere else to go? The alternative is that people actually don't care about customer service, and will just go wherever they get the best deal [or wherever is most convenient], which I guess wouldn't surprise me, either.

It's lame, though. As a middle-aged midwesterner, I do expect some level of friendliness from my customer service representatives, and when I don't get it, I'm confused and displeased. I understand there are some subcultures that don't value, say, eye contact and, you know, talking to the customer, but these broader issues - you promised me X, and I got Y - are systemic, and not individual.

[UncleJoseph]

I guess if everyone sucks at customer service the same amount, customers have nowhere else to go? The alternative is that people actually don't care about customer service, and will just go wherever they get the best deal [or wherever is most convenient], which I guess wouldn't surprise me, either.

Again, you make a brilliant point. I think people don't really care all that much anymore. I've been in some retail establishments that were downright hostile environments for customers...yet people just kept piling in and spending their cash.

I think consumerist priorities have gone off the deep end. Yet, I've had wonderful shopping experiences online. There are several companies I shop with that have excellent customer service, even though it's over the phone:

LA Police Gear
Midway USA
Optics Planet
Cabela's
Crutchfield
Brownell's
My cable company (they aren't online, but their call-in customer service is excellent)
and many more.

It's just the regular retailers (especially big box retailers) that are a train wreck.

[UncleJoseph]

So back in July, I ordered a windshield pouch from Cruiser Customizing for my motorcycle. I need this storage area for my trip in two days. They promptly sent me the pouch, but did not send the special extended nylon mounting bolts or mounting instructions...they were simply missing from the package (which was an OEM-style package). After unsuccessfully trying to mount the pouch for about an hour, I finally went to the manufacturer's (Memphis Shades) website and downloaded the instructions. Here I discovered that the mounting bolts were missing.

I contacted Cruiser Customizing about the problem. They couldn't understand what I was talking about, and said they had to "research" the problem and get back with me. They never got back with me. In the meantime, I also called Memphis Shades, but had to leave a message on their customer service line...they rarely answer the phone.

About a week goes by, and I still hadn't heard back from Cruiser Customizing. I called them again...they had no idea that I had called the first time. This time, they kept me on the line while they called Memphis Shades. I was then told that Memphis Shades was going to send out the part out right away. I waited another week..still no parts. I called Memphis Shades again (this time I got a hold of someone). They had never heard of me, did not have my address in their system, etc...they assured me they would send the bolts (3) in the mail that day. That was August 15.

By Friday last week I still had not yet received the bolts. I contacted Memphis Shades, but, of course, nobody answered. I left another message on their message line. No response by today at 12:45 p.m. I ran a couple errands today and came back home. The mail had been delivered and the shoulder bolts were here!

Yay! I can mount the pouch, right? Wrong. There are only 2 bolts instead of the 3 required to mount the pouch. My zip code had been crossed out on the package because it was incorrect. Plus, they had the wrong part number for my particular pouch written on the part list. I had given them both the correct part number and zip code each time I called. Now we're 2 days from my trip and I need one more bolt.

Called Memphis Shades...no bolts in stock, can't get it to me until Wednesday. Problem is that I leave on Wednesday morning. If they overnight the parts to their factory, then overnight them to me, UPS won't deliver to me until the evening of Wednesday, not the morning. They don't know how to ship directly to UPS distribution center, and can't specify that as an option. The customer service lady said she would check around to see if she could get something to me sooner.

About 15 mins later she had magically found a bolt, and said she could overnight it to me so it would be here by Tuesday night. Really? My confidence is less than solid. We'll see.

[UncleJoseph]

Oh, I forgot the best part:

Cruiser Customizing felt that none of this was their fault because it was a Memphis Shades manufacturer's error that failed to include the bolts and instructions. Memphis Shades felt that this was a Cruiser Customizing problem because Memphis Shades didn't sell the item to me directly, and Cruiser Customizing sold me an incomplete pouch kit.

As a customer, I don't care who is at fault. I don't even feel like it's anyone's fault. I just want my damn pouch mounted so I can take a trip! For fuck's sake!

[3278]

It really makes me amazed that these people can keep companies open. Makes me sanguine about the possibility of owning my own such company, though!

[Serious Paul]

One of the things the internet has complicated in retail is customer service-I'm like a lot of people I know, with out enough free time to properly research online companies so I work greatly from word of mouth. I'd also be willing to add extra layers of inconvenience just to get good, and reliable service.

On the flip side it's allowed a lot of fly by night motherfuckers to abscond with a lot of coin,.

[UncleJoseph]

In keeping with this original post, I have experienced a severe lack of customer service in the last few weeks.

Cruiser Customizing was again to blame for a minor inconvenience, but a silly one not really worth going into.

However, in the last month, we have purchased several thousand dollars' worth of new furniture, and had our back patio expanded (the original one was professionally installed, and was designed so that it could be easily expanded).

Furniture order arrived 3 weeks after we ordered it. Both dressers were badly damaged. Apparently, nobody bothered to check the shipment before loading it onto the truck. The delivery guys were decent, but dinged up my walls in a couple of spots, and didn't catch the damage to one of the dressers before putting it in place. 3 more weeks to wait for the new dressers.

The patio expansion was another matter entirely.

Hired a company last spring to install new paver patio. This was a $4,000 installation. Although they got started late due to weather, it was perfect upon completion. Fast forward to this year. Dealt with the same designer and same company. Settled on an expansion design and price. Went in and paid the 50% deposit on May 3. Estimated time of completion: The week of May 19 (approximately a 2 week wait). No weather issues during that time. Finally called a month later to see what the hold-up was. Was told another project ran long...would be only about 2 more weeks before they would start. Waited until June and called again...was told our designer had quit. Waited a couple of days and found out they had no record of our deposit being applied to our design, which caused our project to just show "pending" in their computer (i.e., the labor staff had no idea the project was ready to be started). Once that was sorted, was told it would be 2 weeks until they got started. Fast forward to last week Monday or Tuesday and they actually did the project. Waited a total of about 2.5 months or so for the patio to be completed.

Once new expansion was done, the color scheme didn't match, the blocks were all uneven and none of the settling from the previous winter had been corrected. Because the settling hadn't been corrected (settling is corrected as part of the original purchase price within 1st year), the new expansion that tied into those areas amplified the settling problem. Company owners were not super-apologetic, but agreed to fix the issues (I think they thought I was being too picky...I wasn't). Just yesterday, patio was torn completely up and re-done, and now it is perfect...exactly the way it should have been the first time.

I am not unreasonable...I realize things happen. They do often seem to happen to me, though, and I have to spend tons of time on the phone trying to put out someone else's brush fires, at my own expense. How hard can it be to provide good service or a good product? It's ridiculous these days.

[3278]

It's really interesting how different companies deal with these situations. The company I work for bends over backward to depend on customer service, because the owner of the company believes - get this! - that if we provide inferior service, some other company will end up with our business! I know, madness, right? There are many, many times we'll lose profit on a single sale, as a loss-leader to make sure we get years of future sales from that customer.

I know the really hard-edged "customer is always right" policies can lead to abuse [like the famous story of a department store who took back a customer's used car tires, with a full refund, even though that store had never, ever sold a single tire in its existence], but my employer's dedication to customer service has allowed us to build a solid reputation within the industry as being generous and extremely helpful to its customers, to the radical benefit of our profits.