Hey Elf

[Instant Cash]

Why are they taking away the booze!!!!!!

AND Pr0n!!!!

Crimes against humanity I tell ya.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/6224994.stm

[Crazy Elf]

Ah, well that's a very very big issue at the moment, and one that the majority of the population really doesn't understand. Alcohol doesn't go well with Aboriginals, due to not having any access to it for around 40,000 years. Every other culture on the planet did have access in some form, but not the Aboriginals. As such, it affects them badly. Less reservations means more of a fallback onto violent behaviour. It's a problem.

The banning was long overdue, though. Some Aboriginal communities have been calling for the ban, and the alcohol suppliers told them, "No, we make money off of it." Hence it needed to be legislated.

As for the porn, child sex abuse has been a major issue in these communities as of late. I'll give you an example that I heard of. Three girls were playing by the water. Drunken Aboriginal guy takes one of the girls into the water, and starts sodomising her while pushing her head under the water. The two friends throw rocks at him to get him to stop, and he keeps going. Girl keeps struggling, yet drowns. Drowns while being sodomised.

That's not an extreme example, either. That's indicative of the sort of shit that was going on in these parts. If you really want, I can dig up the report, but it's probably better off that you don't know. It's horrifying stuff.

So, although I know that this started as a joke, context required me not to be funny. Sorry about that.

[Instant Cash]

To be honest I actually did read up and listen to the "reasons".

I just feel banning is not the way to go.

The Alcohol problem I have yet to come up with a better course of action. The Porn issue is one that confounds me. It has been my experience that access too porn helps curb my desire for sex since Masturbation occurs.

Orgasm a day keeps the stress away.

And while I did say it in a joking manner I was curious as too the local populace opinion. Just my nature, find humor in everything.

[Crazy Elf]

The banning is supported by a wide range of leaders within the Aboriginal community, and has received an awful lot of support right across the board in politics. Both parties have said that this is a good idea. I know that it stinks of Orientalism, whites telling blacks what to do, but I really can't think of a better way to go about things. Fact is, these communities didn't have these problems before alcohol and porn were available to them. We'll see what happens after the ban.

[Salvation122]

Copied Elf's post over to another forum I frequent; Aussie responder follows:

Actually, having read that story in the papers is one of the primary reasons I'm not immediately jumping in with the very valid points following:

1) Howard is getting thrashed to fucking death in the polls by Kevin Rudd
2) Its a truly gorgeous piece of wedge politics, because its impossible to oppose or even question the implementation without looking like you think child sex abuse is just the bomb
3) The guy has been in power for 11 years and only now decides there's a 'state of emergency'? These are long-running problems.
4) Tangential, but the day previous to announcing this, he'd announced the payrises for ministers. Nice deflection of attention there, and also a deflection of attention from several other issues, including a major problem with naval discipline among support workers.

I'm not entirely against the move, however, there are several things it doesn't take into account.

One: a lot of abuse is committed by non-aborigines out there, mostly mine workers, and the proposal involves removing any restrictions to their access to these communities. A parallel problem in the states is white assault on native american women, which your legal system makes much harder to combat than 'ordinary' rape. Also, most of the alcohol/porn/whatever suppliers aren't aboriginal. They're white, and they've made a lot of money off this misery with no censure. Shit, they used to sell flavoured metho to aborigines in Brisbane less than 20 years ago D:

Two: Child sex abuse is also endemic in the non-aboriginal population, and anyone who thinks things aren't just as bad is frankly nuts. Its just better hidden. If he wants to really tackle abuse, these measures need to be applied to the whole population, not just them darkies out in the sticks.

There's a decent thread going at a blog called Larvatus Prodeo if you want more info. I may wind up splitting this if there's enough attention.

Obviously One and Two were shit Elf knows and addressed, and Cat's just a little dense, but the political deflection bits are interesting.

[Instant Cash]

The banning is supported by a wide range of leaders within the Aboriginal community, and has received an awful lot of support right across the board in politics. Both parties have said that this is a good idea. I know that it stinks of Orientalism, whites telling blacks what to do, but I really can't think of a better way to go about things. Fact is, these communities didn't have these problems before alcohol and porn were available to them. We'll see what happens after the ban.

This is a true and valid point. Time will tell if this will work. However I would not blame the tools, rather the people responsible for using them inappropriately.

People should own up to their own inabilities to not be complete asshats.

While I have no disagreement with you that there is a problem, taking things like this awa (in my very uneducated opinion) will only lead to another type of failing in the people.

Pointing the finger syndrome.

[Crazy Elf]

Sal, everyone can see that it's political deflection, so if it was intended as a massive smoke screen, it failed. The pay rise was still captured in the eye of most media institutions that I run across in this country. Then again, I actually pay attention to decent media, so it's hard to say if it didn't work for some smoke. The key point is that Howard didn't gain any popularity out of this, as the opposition said, "Yes, we agree". As a result, it stops being flash issue politics.

As for Cat's points on non-Aboriginal child sex abuse, she's a fucking idiot. The problem with the Aboriginal communities is that there was no policing going through these areas, and thus the acts were far more horrifying than exist in the broader community. To make a comparison between a kid getting fiddled in their home and being sodomised and drowned simultaneously is totally moronic.

Ice, as for the blaming of people rather than tools, that doesn't work. If the communities can't be policed in a way that's in line with how people are policed elsewhere, then other options outside of personal responsibility needs to be looked at. Aboriginal communities work without alcohol, we've seen it before. With it, things go horribly wrong. It's part of the problem, and it needs to be taken out completely to do some damage control. It's a step in the right direction. If this is pointing the finger syndrome, then it's still managed to point at the major problem.

[Instant Cash]

Ice, as for the blaming of people rather than tools, that doesn't work. If the communities can't be policed in a way that's in line with how people are policed elsewhere, then other options outside of personal responsibility needs to be looked at. Aboriginal communities work without alcohol, we've seen it before. With it, things go horribly wrong. It's part of the problem, and it needs to be taken out completely to do some damage control. It's a step in the right direction. If this is pointing the finger syndrome, then it's still managed to point at the major problem.

Adding in the "no Policing" aspect does change the light on the subject.

Without some way to keep people from abusing the things they ae given then the easiest option left is "take it away".

Will be interesting to see how the black market on these items goes in those areas however. If there is a desire (whether imagined or real), people will find a way to make money on it.

[Crazy Elf]

Hence the increased policing. Extra police need to be put in place to stop whites coming into the communities to sell booze for cash and/or sexual favors. The molestation doesn't just happen amongst the Aboriginals themselves, but also from the outsiders seeing easy targets within.

[Instant Cash]

Heard a report this morning on the BBC where some people in the community are speaking out against this saying it is the government’s way of reintroducing authoritarianism on the Aboriginal people.

[Crazy Elf]

They can go get fucked. The ones that say that are typically the Aboriginal activists not actually living in the communities. Their suggestions are all based around the premise that the government should say sorry to the Aboriginals and give them back all their land. Although I agree that the government should say sorry, and actually let Aboriginals utilise the land they've been given, I think it's completely separate from the issues at hand. Many of those communities have been calling for this.

[Daki]

A question I would have is if this will help with the problems at hand or just open up a whole new black market industry to exploit.

[Crazy Elf]

It will help before opening a black market. If you increase the policing, then you can keep whites from bringing booze into the communities. If you knuckle down on them, hard, you're going to discourage it, at the very least.

[Daki]

Well if I were inclined towards criminal enterprises, I'd be all over setting up booze smuggling into those areas. I think you are right though, it will abate the problem.