Firefox is fat as fuck

[3278]

I've been having a ton of problems with Firefox lately, many involving its new "keep the last eight pages stuffed in RAM" feature, which means Firefox ends up sucking up nearly as much RAM as Azureus, and some just involving it being, you know, slow. And I wondered if anyone else had noticed that Firefox was walking the same road as IE: more features.

Well, other people noticed, too.

I always think it's amusing how people cut on Microsoft. "This OS is bloated! Linux is faster! I can't use this browser because it has so much shit." Except people don't realize MS is just trying to satisfy its market, which is, like, 80 percent of the people out there. When your OS needs to run on any computer, when it needs to drive every piece of hardware - MP3 players, cameras, scanners, speakers, USB audio cards, 16-monitor systems - you end up with bloat. When your browser needs to be able to view every page on the net, and accept hundreds of extensions and plugins, you end up with bloat. When your Office software needs to do every single operation any of the millions of people who use it want it to, you end up with bloat.

"Oh no," cry the MS deniers. "Look at Linux!" I did. And it is so far from satisfying every consumer out there that it's not a viable OS for MS's market. Yeah, it's sleek. Yeah, it's fast. But it ain't no 80-percent-market-share OS, and it's not going to be. Firefox, in the interests of increasing market share, keeps trying to please more people, and that means more bloat.

Companies keep coming out with slimmed-down products, because people are so sick of bloat, but then they realize they can't do all those fancy things they wanted to. Ever try to use Google's app suite, and then compare it to Office? I'm sure it's okay for some people, but in my work production environment, it would never be even close to useful. Google - like Firefox - had the laudable goal of making all your bloat optional, but the framework to support the optional bloat ends up being bloat, itself.

I understand the problem. I used to add any feature I thought was even remotely cool to Bulldrek, until it was a teetering disaster waiting to happen. [Which it did.] When I built freespeech [and its predecessor, Bulldrek v2] I went in the other direction: take everything out users don't absolutely have to have. And would you know it? I think people prefer Bulldrek to freespeech, in functionality and convenience. I think users, though they complain like crazy, like bloat, need bloat. I think you can slim your bloat down as much as possible, and built a more efficient framework, but if you're going to be massively popular, you have to include something for everyone.

[DV8]

I never have trouble with Firefox, to be honest. Perhaps I'm lucky, but I also do'nt use any add-ons since I like my browser simple and fast.

[Adam]

I don't use Firefox daily anymore because I prefer Safari, although I keep Firefox around for some of the extensions that are handy. I haven't upgraded to the latest versions on my Windows box for ages, and the OS X port has always been a little wacky, so I chalk it up to issues with the port -- and use it less.

Which version did this 8-pages-in-RAM feature come in, version 2? Looks like I'm still at 1.5 on my laptop.

[DV8]

...I prefer Safari...

I find that Safari acts funny with backgrounds, fading, and javascript support.

[Adam]

I find that Safari rocks eggs on fucking toast. It has bugs, sure [the animated GIF rendering engine sucks hard, but they've fixed that in the latest WebKit builds], but every browser does.

[3278]

Which version did this 8-pages-in-RAM feature come in, version 2? Looks like I'm still at 1.5 on my laptop.

Yeah, it's 2, I believe. Possibly even a point version, but I don't remember. There is, apparently, a workaround, but I try not to worry very much about how much RAM I'm using. I generally have enough.

I absolutely love Firefox. I really do like the extensions I use [uh, both of them] and they really do make my life easier. And it's still better than, say, IE. Firefox isn't really to blame, I don't think, and I don't want to hack on Firefox. It's a symptom, and not the disease.

[DV8]

I find that Safari rocks eggs on fucking toast.

The interface for Safari on OSX does indeed, but it has too many things that irk me when I'm designing and building a webpage.

[Jeff Hauze]

I tried using Firefox. But I've never honestly had any problems with IE. And Firefox, as an end user (and not a terribly technical minded end user), doesn't really seem at all different than IE. I understand why other folks might use different browsers, especially if building sites. But as just a fellow browsing the web? It's never made a difference to me.

[Ancient History]

Jeff used Netscape for years before switching boxes and found all it had on it was IE 6.

[Adam]

With IE7 out, it's a lot harder to argue that the average person should be using Firefox. IE7 has better malware/popup blocking, tabbed browsing, etc. Although I find the interface a little odd -- I want to add a Refresh buttonn to the toolbar, and I can't seem to figure out how to do it. [Yes, I could hit F5, but I generally connect to my Windows box via VNC...]

[DV8]

When it comes to the space the interface takes up, Firefox still beats IE7.

[Jeff Hauze]

Jeff used Netscape for years before switching boxes and found all it had on it was IE 6.

Uhh...sure. Except the part about using Netscape. I've used IE since I've been online, even when I still back in AOL-hell.

[Brasky]

32- I just upgraded to 2.0 on my home computer (I've been using it for several weeks on my laptop)-- and I've noticed I'm having the same problems. Much slower. It's even shutting down on my unexpectedly-- but I do like the session restore that takes me back to where I was-- I'd just rather not have to be using that so often.

On my laptop, though, I haven't been having any problems.