Bulldrek v3.0

Cain

The suicide bomber clearly has no regard for his own safety, and neither do his superiors. You don't know that to be true. I've always read they have a very high regard for their lives, which is what their giving up, not their safety. (I recall several bombers being buckled in, by the by.) Where as...

Cain

Cain

Democratically elected my ass. And don't go comparing this to the florida del with bush, cuz it's apple's and oranges. I don't hold any "democratic" election to be valid if there wasn't atleast another person runnign against Saddam. Then you don't believe that all US elections are valid? ...

Cain

Cain

I'm no expert on this sort of thing, seeing as how I lack either the scientific or theological knowledge to make any such assertion. But if Stephen Hawking says it's possible, I'm inclined to believe that it is possible.

Cain

You know, except for the Democratically-elected government part. Or the limiting their attacks to Military targets. Actually, Saddam was democratically elected , if only by a technicality. And I did say "focused"-- most of the attacks have been roadside bombs designed to go off on militar...

Cain

Cain

I think of terrorism as meaning a group outside of the government that plan the killing of many people. What happens if they're an ousted, but previously legitimate, government? Let's say it's the remnants of a democratically-elected government, overthrown via military coup, who focus their attacks...

Cain

Cain

That's only true if you teach history in a vacuum. If you combine history and culture lessons with critical-thinking skills-- which, naturally, is part of what they're *supposed* to teach us-- then people are less apt to mindlessly repeat what they've been told.

Cain

I'm going with Sal here, since The Prince specifically deals with ruling an area, while Sun Tzu is primarily concerned with military campaigning. Sun Tzu didn't address this sort of issue nearly as directly as Machiavelli did. Not that it means you're wrong, Ghotty-- Machiavelli did have something t...

Cain

Cain

I never realized what being a parent actually does to you. You can hear about it all you like; there's nothing like actually *becoming* a parent.

Cain

Cain

Well, the flip answer is: "A short overview of everything", but that's not really useful to this discussion. IMO, we'd need at least an overview of the cultures of all First World nations, as well as the prominent Second World ones. Those are the ones who are most likely to affect us, and ...

Cain

I started down this line of thinking myself, and then discounted it. While every branch of history has arguably affected all of humanity, I see a distinction between how different ethnic groups were affected. To use my earlier example, studying the world wars, which literally did affect all of huma...

Cain

All history is cultural. Without cultural relevancy, history becomes nothing more than a dry, dusty, recitation of dates and names. What makes history important is the lessons it teaches us-- and that depends on our cultural understanding.

Cain

I'm not certain if you're joking or not, but presuming that you're serious, yes, it does, specifically, "that God is an illusion." But if everything else is as well, then reality is only illusion as well. As such, God is as real as anything else. It still doesn't say what the nature of go...

Cain

BTW, I also found this in the Abagail Township v Schempp decision: The fact is that the line which separates the secular from the sectarian in American life is elusive. The difficulty of defining the boundary with precision inheres in a paradox central to our scheme of liberty. While our institution...

Cain

Okay, I emailed the Atheist Alliance: Is atheism legally considered a religion, or is exemption granted on educational terms? To which they replied: Our exemption is granted as an educational organization. If we were a religion, we would not have to file tax form 990, and therefore for all practica...

Cain

Cain

That doesn't really answer the question. There is still a statement toward religion or divinity in that philosophy. Really? Where does it make any statement about the *actual* nature of divinity? Oh, wait, it doesn't.... :wink: That's what made it ironic. You provided the evidence that contradicted...

Cain

Cain

One can't really have a belief that one doesn't feel is superior to all others. If one knows another belief is superior, then one would be intellectually bankrupt to hold the inferior belief. Or you can hold all theories in more-or-less equal esteem. That's basically the classic definition of agnos...

Cain

2) 3278 could be describing agnostic atheism, insofar as agnostic atheism is a certain type of weak atheism, but knowing 32 I'm sure he's not. The statement about agnostic atheism in the athiesm article emphasizes that 'agnostic atheism' is generally used for cases in which an atheist asserts that ...

Cain

If I were agnostic or apathetic, I might give other opinions more weight, but I'm a soft atheist. Which straddles the line between agnostic and athiest; but does nome mean you're xclusively one or the other. If you had to be strictly honest about it, you know your views would be marginally more one...

Cain

Like fuck it's not simple, Cain. Call the IRS and ask if an atheist organisation can get tax exemption on the basis of religion. If they can, then legally they're a religion. Dude, the 24-hour Electric Church of Elvis can become tax-exempt. However, I have found several atheist organizations that c...

Cain

There are three clear segments referred to here: "non-believers," "religions based on a belief in the existence of God," and "religions founded on different beliefs." That would imply that non-believers are not members of religions founded on different beliefs, but a c...

Cain

You're assuming they mean that anything not of the former is atheism - religion not based on a belief in the existence of God - without considering that there are many true religions not based on a belief in the existence of God: the Hindu faith, for instance, or any other polytheistic religion. No...

Cain

American Atheists comes immediately to mind. And I have no idea, actually. I presume they're at least non-profit, which tends to also be tax-exempt, with or without a religious affiliation-- so that wouldn't be a telling factor. A simple way to solve the government outlook on atheism is to call the...

Cain

This does delineate between religions based on a belief in the existence of God and religions founded on different beliefs, but does not state or imply that atheism is one of the latter. Come on, now. If atheism is not based on a belief in the existance of God, it is in the latter category. Disbeli...

Cain

Cain

Treating a topic as a secular issue uses a vastly different meaning for 'secular' than the term 'secular clergy.' There is, you will note, a definition of 'secular' specifically assigned for use in 'secular clergy. "Secular" wasn't my choice of words at any event; but if you'll look at th...

Cain

I have no real knowledge of any major atheistic organisations, but of those that you know, do they pay tax or are they exempt? American Atheists comes immediately to mind. And I have no idea, actually. I presume they're at least non-profit, which tends to also be tax-exempt, with or without a relig...

Cain

No, it's not restricted to Catholics. I said as much in my post. It does, however, refer to Christian spiritual leaders. Stop trying to use it as something very different. Yes, "secular clergy" does refer to spiritual leaders, of any faith. The only restriction is that they be more "...

Cain

That does not, however, make the belief a religion. It is "about religion," and in that sense can be considered "religious," but it is not "religion," and so is not "religious" in that sense. No, but it does not exclude things the way you've mentioned. It is,...

Cain

A "superior power," sure, if you like. Not a supreme being. It's not theistic. Insofar as such beliefs are taken on faith, well, fine and not germane to the topic. Such beliefs may or may not be religious. Of course, not all nonscientific beliefs constitute religions. Such beliefs are als...

Cain

Anybody else think that price will drop like a rock when this technology matures?

More like "when the technology can be built by cheap Asian labor"; or when the ability to produce knock-offs appears.

Cain

Except that, there, is not a definition of religion. Except that it is. Again, it might come about it in an opposite fashion, but there's no denying that it amounts to the same thing. It couldn't possibly be any clearer. Theist doctrines are religions because a religion is explicitly defined as a b...

Cain

Cain

Not in a negative fashion, not as an inverse god: the absence of gods is what they're talking about. That is a priori not religious. Again: a belief about religions is, by definition, a religious belief. There's no two ways about it-- it is, as you put it, axiomatic. How is spirituality involved? W...

Cain

There's also no such thing as a "negative religion." There are, as we've admitted, atheistic religions. "Negative religions," the way you keep talking about it, would need a definition which read: "Belief in and reverence for, or disbelief in and disdain for a supernatural ...

Cain

Cain

Correct, he did not, since Madeline Murray's sons - provided they are teaching atheism - are not "spiritual" leaders. Again, they are indeed teaching about spirituality, albeit in a negative fashion. They're actively attempting to convert the masses to their views, and preaching a brand o...

Cain

Cain

Cain

But the non-existance of a deity is not "based on the teachings of a spiritual leader," so this test still fails under definition 3. Really? So, if someone became an atheist after attending a seminar held by one of Madeline Murray's sons, he did not derive his beliefs "based on the t...

Cain

Sure, something like that. The set of beliefs and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader is a religion. Atheism is not a set of beliefs and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader. Athiests may follow teachings of a spiritual leader, and thus practice religion. The sp...

Cain

Cain

And if you think this is something that religions do, well then I'll thank you for conceding. My original statement, after all, was that if atheism is a religion it is precisely as much as a belief that sentient extraterrestrials are not playing in your trunk - a belief not objectively testable bec...

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